I was so scared you were going to leave me in a pile of depression about plant-based meats :)
I find plant-based meats funny though. We take plants, then turn them into something meat like. That is still inefficient! Just because it is far more efficient than raising animals, wouldn't we still be better off just eating the plants? But, we have only started in this sector of biotechnology. I have no doubt in 10-20 years we will be eating plant-based meats that unlike any of the flesh we find in the wild.
On an anti-specieist note, what we eat influences our morals (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0195666310003648?via%3Dihub=). When people don't eat animals, they no longer have to do mental gymnastics to defend why it is okay to eat animals. So as plant-based meats rise, I expect more regular everyday folks to start giving moral status to animals they currently eat. Then we start passing those meat banning laws, starting in Berkeley of course ;)
Wayne what are you doing at Costco 😜 JK. Your blogs always make me feel so many mixed emotions sadness, happiness, anxiety, heartwarmed, confused with all that smart lawyer and nerd lingo haha not bashing. I'm a computer nerd, but you're definitely high class and use those big words and statistics. Funny I aced statistics, but always failed math, but passed cuz the extra credit 😛 Anywho. Man, thats worrisome the stocks plummeted, but I guess its to be expected with all the inflation. Vegan meats are way expensive so they definitely need to get with the program because unfortunately most ppl go with whats cheap. I think real meat should be very expensive so the animals can be truly open range, etc, but IDK if fully plant-based will be the future. I am rooting for lab grown meat because I think there will always be meat eaters. Vegan cheeses I am sorry taste like shit. Still gotta get that one fixed lol so cost, taste and access to vegan foods I think is what hinders the progress and of course just stubborn ignorant ppl like the Cracker Barrel customers who just refuse to try sthg new. I think though extremes on all ends will still destroy us. My friend's daughter is Vegan, but she won't even eat almonds BC sthg in the production kills some kind of bacteria or sthg and I heard almond productions is horrible for the environment too using tons of water and land. I just think theres too many ppl period. Earth cannot sustain us. Either way might be too late, but maybe humans will go extinct then a new race of creatures and the vicious circle starts again.
Hello! I think Daiya brand American slices, Cheddar slices, and the Mexican 4 Cheeze blend are pretty good. You still might not like them, but if you haven't tried them it'd be worth a shot. I get them from Kroger, so I'd think they'd be available at other national outlets. I agree some of these products still need tweaking, I still have yet to find a good vegan cream cheese.
Yeah I've tried DAIYA too and bleh, but I have never tried the slices or Mexican Cheese Blend. I found other brands that promise to taste legit online and some are only international, but I am open to trying them all until I find sthg that doesn't taste like plastic 😛 which Kraft cheese always did. I know with technology its gonna improve. Thanks Dave! XOXO
Perhaps the falling stock prices reflect a fading fad? Trendy folks moving on to the newest diet of the month? Perhaps overly optimistic in their projections? And/or people are falling back on their comfort foods as a way to cope with life's overwhelming stressors? I wonder what the stock prices for Cargill, Tyson, or JBS Holdings would be without government subsidies? They say 1 pound of ground beef would cost the consumer somewhere in the range of $40.00 if it were not for the free tax money these companies receive. In 2015 it was said to be around $30.00 -> "In most of the countries, the meat industry gets more subsidies from the government than the
fruit and vegetable industries though the same governments recommend their citizens to eat
more vegetables and fruits.
The U.S government spends $38 billion each year to subsidize the meat and dairy industries, but
only 0.04 percent of that (i.e., $17 million) each year to subsidize fruits and vegetables. A $5 Big
Mac would cost $13 if the retail price included hidden expenses that meat producers offload onto
society. A pound of hamburger will cost $30 without any government subsidies."
I also heard or read somewhere that the amount these companies receive in the form of subsidies are also drafted upon speculation and the loss of customers (i.e. people switching to a vegetarian or vegan lifestyle) are also factored in, so in effect the government just steps in to cover the lack of "support". Projections always seem to be inflated no matter the project, which might imply the meat producers are able to actually profit from our absence as customers? Anyone know if this is in fact true?
The connection between animal agriculture and the climate catastrophe that is currently underway needs to be emphasized so boldly that it can't be ignored. Personally I find it to be more productive when advocating for animal rights to highlight the environmental impacts that affect human life as opposed to trying to get a human to fully empathize with the life of a cow or chicken. At the moment we can't really abstain from oil and gas on a personal level. I don't think I even know anyone personally that can afford an electric car. Some people seem to respond well to the idea that rather than waiting for the colossal fossil fuel freaks to switch their methods we can make changes to our own personal diets with the hope and intention that meat & dairy producers will eventually cater to the new demand, thus bringing about less animal farming which of course would result in less pollution. The health aspects also seem to resonate. I don't listen to Rogan, but am aware of his stance regarding hunting and factory farming. Stating to those of a more rural persuasion (for lack of a better term) that I am way more comfortable with hunting, generally speaking, than I am with factory farming has been sort of a tension breaker and within some of those conversations I have been able to evoke some empathy for cows. Perhaps I should say that I have also made a point to admit to not being very nice to tree stands that I've come across, I think bow hunting should be banned, and rather than relying on humans to "manage" populations we should support the reintroduction and well being of apex predators.
Mainstream news outlets need to be bolder. If an advertiser backs out (usually only for a period of time) in response to a news story or opinion piece then so be it. Every now and again while eating lunch I'll catch some of the Good Morning America Afternoon (I think it's called?), the full time medical advisor person on the panel switched to a vegan diet thanks to the (off camera) insight and influence of one of her other co-hosts for which she gave credit. The emotion, pride mixed with vulnerability, and the humble yearning for support and acceptance felt to me to be on par with someone coming out of the closet for the first time in a family meeting. I think she's eating fish now, but I bring this up because it was amazing to see her try and talk openly and honestly about a plant based diet without "stepping out of line" with animal ag and its zillions of advertising dollars.
These behemoths will pivot if they see a big enough shift in the marketplace. A number of these companies have even dipped their toes into the plant-based arena by way of investing (like Tyson investing in Beyond Meat) or forming new subsidiaries. The line between these droughts, heat waves, forest fires, floods, ocean acidity and dead zones, the increased intensity of tropical storms and industrial animal ag are both substantial and undeniable. I guess it will take a lot more than U.N. climate reports to make this palpable to the general public.
Heck yeah, the future is plant based! There will be no cattle farms on Mars! (at least I hope not)
In my view the future of meat and dairy isn't in plant-based substitutes, it is in animal milk and meat, not from milking or killing but "made' in a factory. As an example the Israelis are only a few years away from its commercial production. Those interested may kindly search for "Remilk".
Very informative article! I hope the plant-based food system happens sooner rather than later.
I was so scared you were going to leave me in a pile of depression about plant-based meats :)
I find plant-based meats funny though. We take plants, then turn them into something meat like. That is still inefficient! Just because it is far more efficient than raising animals, wouldn't we still be better off just eating the plants? But, we have only started in this sector of biotechnology. I have no doubt in 10-20 years we will be eating plant-based meats that unlike any of the flesh we find in the wild.
On an anti-specieist note, what we eat influences our morals (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0195666310003648?via%3Dihub=). When people don't eat animals, they no longer have to do mental gymnastics to defend why it is okay to eat animals. So as plant-based meats rise, I expect more regular everyday folks to start giving moral status to animals they currently eat. Then we start passing those meat banning laws, starting in Berkeley of course ;)
Wayne what are you doing at Costco 😜 JK. Your blogs always make me feel so many mixed emotions sadness, happiness, anxiety, heartwarmed, confused with all that smart lawyer and nerd lingo haha not bashing. I'm a computer nerd, but you're definitely high class and use those big words and statistics. Funny I aced statistics, but always failed math, but passed cuz the extra credit 😛 Anywho. Man, thats worrisome the stocks plummeted, but I guess its to be expected with all the inflation. Vegan meats are way expensive so they definitely need to get with the program because unfortunately most ppl go with whats cheap. I think real meat should be very expensive so the animals can be truly open range, etc, but IDK if fully plant-based will be the future. I am rooting for lab grown meat because I think there will always be meat eaters. Vegan cheeses I am sorry taste like shit. Still gotta get that one fixed lol so cost, taste and access to vegan foods I think is what hinders the progress and of course just stubborn ignorant ppl like the Cracker Barrel customers who just refuse to try sthg new. I think though extremes on all ends will still destroy us. My friend's daughter is Vegan, but she won't even eat almonds BC sthg in the production kills some kind of bacteria or sthg and I heard almond productions is horrible for the environment too using tons of water and land. I just think theres too many ppl period. Earth cannot sustain us. Either way might be too late, but maybe humans will go extinct then a new race of creatures and the vicious circle starts again.
Hello! I think Daiya brand American slices, Cheddar slices, and the Mexican 4 Cheeze blend are pretty good. You still might not like them, but if you haven't tried them it'd be worth a shot. I get them from Kroger, so I'd think they'd be available at other national outlets. I agree some of these products still need tweaking, I still have yet to find a good vegan cream cheese.
Yeah I've tried DAIYA too and bleh, but I have never tried the slices or Mexican Cheese Blend. I found other brands that promise to taste legit online and some are only international, but I am open to trying them all until I find sthg that doesn't taste like plastic 😛 which Kraft cheese always did. I know with technology its gonna improve. Thanks Dave! XOXO
Oh, that's cool! Yeah, you probably won't like the slices & the Mex 4 Cheeze then. Good luck with those new found brands!
thnx Dave! 🤗
Perhaps the falling stock prices reflect a fading fad? Trendy folks moving on to the newest diet of the month? Perhaps overly optimistic in their projections? And/or people are falling back on their comfort foods as a way to cope with life's overwhelming stressors? I wonder what the stock prices for Cargill, Tyson, or JBS Holdings would be without government subsidies? They say 1 pound of ground beef would cost the consumer somewhere in the range of $40.00 if it were not for the free tax money these companies receive. In 2015 it was said to be around $30.00 -> "In most of the countries, the meat industry gets more subsidies from the government than the
fruit and vegetable industries though the same governments recommend their citizens to eat
more vegetables and fruits.
The U.S government spends $38 billion each year to subsidize the meat and dairy industries, but
only 0.04 percent of that (i.e., $17 million) each year to subsidize fruits and vegetables. A $5 Big
Mac would cost $13 if the retail price included hidden expenses that meat producers offload onto
society. A pound of hamburger will cost $30 without any government subsidies."
20 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humane_Slaughter_Act (found within: https://scet.berkeley.edu/wp-content/uploads/CopyofFINALSavingThePlanetSustainableMeatAlternatives.pdf ).
I also heard or read somewhere that the amount these companies receive in the form of subsidies are also drafted upon speculation and the loss of customers (i.e. people switching to a vegetarian or vegan lifestyle) are also factored in, so in effect the government just steps in to cover the lack of "support". Projections always seem to be inflated no matter the project, which might imply the meat producers are able to actually profit from our absence as customers? Anyone know if this is in fact true?
The connection between animal agriculture and the climate catastrophe that is currently underway needs to be emphasized so boldly that it can't be ignored. Personally I find it to be more productive when advocating for animal rights to highlight the environmental impacts that affect human life as opposed to trying to get a human to fully empathize with the life of a cow or chicken. At the moment we can't really abstain from oil and gas on a personal level. I don't think I even know anyone personally that can afford an electric car. Some people seem to respond well to the idea that rather than waiting for the colossal fossil fuel freaks to switch their methods we can make changes to our own personal diets with the hope and intention that meat & dairy producers will eventually cater to the new demand, thus bringing about less animal farming which of course would result in less pollution. The health aspects also seem to resonate. I don't listen to Rogan, but am aware of his stance regarding hunting and factory farming. Stating to those of a more rural persuasion (for lack of a better term) that I am way more comfortable with hunting, generally speaking, than I am with factory farming has been sort of a tension breaker and within some of those conversations I have been able to evoke some empathy for cows. Perhaps I should say that I have also made a point to admit to not being very nice to tree stands that I've come across, I think bow hunting should be banned, and rather than relying on humans to "manage" populations we should support the reintroduction and well being of apex predators.
Mainstream news outlets need to be bolder. If an advertiser backs out (usually only for a period of time) in response to a news story or opinion piece then so be it. Every now and again while eating lunch I'll catch some of the Good Morning America Afternoon (I think it's called?), the full time medical advisor person on the panel switched to a vegan diet thanks to the (off camera) insight and influence of one of her other co-hosts for which she gave credit. The emotion, pride mixed with vulnerability, and the humble yearning for support and acceptance felt to me to be on par with someone coming out of the closet for the first time in a family meeting. I think she's eating fish now, but I bring this up because it was amazing to see her try and talk openly and honestly about a plant based diet without "stepping out of line" with animal ag and its zillions of advertising dollars.
These behemoths will pivot if they see a big enough shift in the marketplace. A number of these companies have even dipped their toes into the plant-based arena by way of investing (like Tyson investing in Beyond Meat) or forming new subsidiaries. The line between these droughts, heat waves, forest fires, floods, ocean acidity and dead zones, the increased intensity of tropical storms and industrial animal ag are both substantial and undeniable. I guess it will take a lot more than U.N. climate reports to make this palpable to the general public.
Heck yeah, the future is plant based! There will be no cattle farms on Mars! (at least I hope not)
Much love!
Good luck in the debate, Wayne!
In my view the future of meat and dairy isn't in plant-based substitutes, it is in animal milk and meat, not from milking or killing but "made' in a factory. As an example the Israelis are only a few years away from its commercial production. Those interested may kindly search for "Remilk".